Loot box odds? Required per Apples Developer TOS


#1

Any update as to when Scopely will publish odds for all RNG pulls? @kalishane

https://developer.apple.com/app-store/review/guidelines/#gaming-gambling-and-lotteries

Specifically section 3.1.1 In App Purchases


#2

Reference: Apps offering “loot boxes” or other mechanisms that provide randomized virtual items for purchase must disclose the odds of receiving each type of item to customers prior to purchase.

If you don’t mind me piggy backing on this topic, any chance you can say exactly what this policy effects in-game? It’s on the nose with “loot boxes” so any bag, crate, box, whatever that is chance based in the shop right now is what it refers too. That’s pretty clear. I think it’s safe to say it would extend to premiere recruits and weapons wheels, stashes, elite character and weapon token wheels, basic tokens, since all those can be pulled with coins and the result you receive is based on rng.

But there are other randomized aspects of the games that, while they don’t follow the typical format, COULD fall under the requirement. Take the supply depot for example. You can pay with coins to refresh the depot BUT the contents that are available when refreshed is a result of randomization/chance right? In other words when you pay for a refresh there is a CHANCE for a sale (or greater sale) or CHANCE for a specific item to appear. When you think about it that way, to me, but I’m not an expert, it sounds like it fits perfectly under the new policy so it should have odds revealed including the chance for every item and every degree of sale, right? Cause that sounds like A LOT of work lol. But, you can also say that you are not paying for any of those items directly, therefore you are not being “provided” anything for purchase, because you pay for them with supply points not coin refreshes, so based on that, those odds don’t need to be known. The grand old problem of shaky definitions, leads to loopholes and controversy.

^Don’t take that as a demand. And I’m not being a smarty pants either. I’m really just curious. And not even just in regards to RTS, games on the app store in general. It’s just interesting to figure out what Apple expects, how far their definition goes, and how they’ll enforce their new policy across all apps.


#5

If Apple decides to implement it in the slightest forms, technically everything in the game will be susceptible. Like many of examples you pointed out, it’s hard to say for now what will or won’t be affected. Since Apple’s new policy affects so many apps in their stores, we don’t even know if there will be push back from some companies depending on whatever contract they had to begin with.


#6

I did… talked to tech and dev support… they are in the process of detailing their requirments in 3.1.1 as far as time frames for compliance

I was also told to be on the lookout for an email from their compliance office.

Also… it shouldn’t be my fucking job to dig out information that should be coming from Scopely @kalishane


#7

Developers all around must be in hell right now. I can imagine upcoming, unreleased mobile games totally ditching RNG before their games even enter beta.


#9

Lets keep it alive then, these questions need to be answered.

I can see scopelys response to be just killing it from the apple play store and making it android only.


#10

God forbid developers make a game that is enjoyable… :wink:

I’d happily pay to download something, knowing that the content was there, and that it was a genuinely good game. Now everything is free to download, but riddled with pay-walls and loot boxes. Good ol’ corporate greed: ruining things since forever.


#11

I agree with you


#12

Not only is it important to disclose odds, important data like allotment % of digital assets per promotion should be disclosed as well so users understand what’s in circulation and can plan spending accordingly to counter act against the meta. To be honest transparency like this motivates spending.

Otherwise, what’s the point?


#13

That has mass refunds written all over it tho


#14

I have the update. Never. They will just let apple delete the game from the store


#15

Funny how we have to follow scopley ToS, but scopley can ingore another ToS.


#16

Depends on when Apple decides to start enforcing that ToS. Until now, I don’t know and no one has mentioned a game that has their odds posted because of Apple’s new policy. That’s not to say that just because other’s haven’t done it, Scopely can get away with it too, but rather there’s clearly more to the inner workings than just a new policy being posted.


#17

May Scopely be their first case


#18

Funny how this topic has been forgotten. Scopely would be smart to follow many others apps and post odds before they get booted off the app store. Unless… That’s been the [REDACTED]


#19


#21

I would love to see that players prestige


#23

lol